At the start of this season we interviewed Gary Bennett about Racism in football. Today he received an MBE in the New Year’s honours list for his work for Show Racism The Red Card, so we thought it topical to run that piece again…
‘Gan on Midnight, kick the black bastard.’ I remember it like it was yesterday. I was in the Roker End, around about 1990, and our captain had made one of his incredible tackles, breaking down the opposition’s move and starting one of our own with an insightful pass from the centre of defence.
Gary Bennett is, in my years of watching Sunderland, one of the finest centre halves we have had. His reading of the game, his commitment to the cause, his never-say-die attitude were and things which every fan loved. Of course, to many he is now sidekick to Barnesy on Radio Newcastle, telling us about 30 seconds before it happens that we’re about to concede. However you know him, you know we love him and always have. We must have done because we gave him a nickname – Midnight.
It was the man standing just behind me who shouted out his praise, totally oblivious to the fact that, in one sentence, he had summed up the stupidity and total lack of logic in racism. Benno was our black player so he was ok, even with his own racist nickname. Their striker was simply a ‘black bastard’.
When I spoke to him, years later, I apologised for having used his nickname in my youth. ‘But you’ve learned it was wrong?’ he asked. ‘Yes, of course’. ‘Then that’s all that matters. We’re all learning all the time.’
After the disgraceful incidents following England’s defeat in the Euro final, I caught up with Benno to see if we’d really learned anything after all.
‘We’re no further forwards. We’ve been having this conversation for 30 or 40 years and yet we keep having it. And nothing changes. We take a step forward and then we’re straight back again.’
I asked him if it was any different within football rather than with the fans. Had there been a change in the game?
‘Why would that be any different? Because they’re footballers they aren’t racist? It makes no difference. There are racists in all parts of society. It never ends.’
I asked if he still suffered from racism in his life.
‘Every day. But I wouldn’t call it suffering. It’s something I’ve got used to.’
I was shocked to hear this. Gary Bennett? Sunderland legend? Facing racism?
‘It’s impossible to understand unless you’ve lived it. If you go to a country which is predominantly black skinned people, how does it feel? That feeling of being unsecure, unsafe, like you don’t belong there. That’s how a person of colour feels frequently, especially when they, for example, walk into a boardroom. If I go to a function room at Sunderland, or a training pitch or the academy, more often than not, I’m the only person of colour. I stand out. And the big problem we have is it becomes natural. Natural for me to feel uncomfortable and natural for others not to expect me to be there. We need to stop that. We could raise a few eyebrows in boardrooms in all business areas by putting people in there.’
This is effectively the Rooney Rule, the idea of positive discrimination requiring certain demographic groups to be included on shortlists, within squads or, perhaps, in the boardroom. I asked if that would help in football.
‘It has to. We need to get away from people thinking black people in coaching and management roles are unusual. Make that the new natural.’
And you don’t think football clubs will do it without that shove?
‘They don’t. Look at Dwight Yorke or Sol Campbell compared to Steven Gerrard or Frank Lampard. Similar standard players, same qualifications, but two of them get Derby and Rangers as their first jobs. I don’t think it’s a conscious racism but there’s no other explanation for it. That’s why they need the shove.’
Why do you think it happens?
‘I don’t think we know. It’s a natural human reaction. We are attracted to interact with people we think we’ll have something in common with and it depends what setting you’re in. Look at Sunderland and Newcastle fans. On Saturdays there’s no love lost between them, you’d support anyone playing against them but then on holiday, on the other side of the world, you’d be drawn to chat to them. The North East link becomes stronger than the football.’
‘In the Euros, the England v Scotland thing was the same. The fans who wouldn’t support England or English sportsmen are then cheering on the English athletes in the Olympics. It’s not that we just wake up one day and don’t like people. I think if you asked people why they don’t like Scotland or whatever they wouldn’t know. Nationality, religion, skin colour, it’s all the same mentality. But the people in those situations would probably say it’s just banter.
‘People don’t say things they don’t mean. Banter or not, they mean it. And then you’re into pushing boundaries. Banter becomes bullying and bullying becomes violence. If you don’t mean it, don’t say it.’
What role does the media play? They’re the ones who push the nationalism angle, like with Andy Murray being British until he loses.
‘They play a huge part of it. A big problem. How they report players is incredible. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a white player with a black girlfriend even get a mention but some papers make a story out of a white girl with a black player. Look at the Euros. Two players from my old club. The papers went on and on about how great Phil Foden was, how he’d done great to get to where he was, how he gave money to his parents, stuff like that. Raheem Sterling was amazing in that tournament but didn’t get any coverage like that. Last tournament Sterling changed his hair and the papers said he was flash, this time people copied Foden.’
So, what do we do?
‘There has to be change. A lot of the people who boo taking the knee don’t realise it’s because we want change. They think we want to be seen taking a knee to say racism is wrong. It’s not about that. It’s about pushing people and reminding them that forty years on we’ve still not got change. The t-shirts and badges for kick it out and show racism the red card was the same. It’s not about saying, yes, racism is bad, and kneeling, or wearing a t-shirt to mark that. It’s about reminding people we need change. Proper changes to legislation and education that, hopefully, leads to a change in mentality.’
What legislation would you change?
‘I think social media needs rules that stop people saying things or knowing they’ll face serious action if they do. But the politicians are no different from anyone else. They can say they understand but they don’t. And they won’t until they’ve walked into a shop and been looked at like they expect to be robbed, or having a nice car and knowing you’ll be stopped by the police because of your skin colour. They can’t understand what it’s like so where’s their motivation to change? So we have to remind them as often as possible.’
And education?
‘Schools have to play a big part in educating people that we’ve much more in common than we have that’s different. But everyone has to be on the same page for it to work. If the parents are racist you’re wasting your time. Or the teachers. People say teachers can’t be racist because they’re teachers. How does that work? There are racists everywhere, being teachers doesn’t exempt them. We’ve got to change people’s mentality. Everyone’s mentality. To see the similarities and not the differences. A third of the England team at the Euros weren’t white but were just as proud to wear that shirt and gave everything. The tournament brought us all together but then, when it went wrong, who got blamed straight away? Who got insulted and abused?’
Can we learn from the Pride and Women In Football campaigns?
‘There are steps forward. Slowly but surely we’re getting better with equal rights. But you still hear a lot of comments that there’s too many women on TV sport commentary or too many gay couples in adverts. They’re saying it about the Olympics now. There’s still a long way to go.’
And with the new season, what would you like to see from the clubs?
‘There’ll be some clubs where you’ll hear boos when players take a knee and they do nothing. Clubs should stand up to them. But more important is that people learn why they’re taking the knee. Why it’s needed. Every day we learn things, every day. If you asked people why they boo I don’t think many could tell you. Actually, I think sometimes there’s a fear of that lack of understanding which makes it worse. So we need to explain. Understanding that it’s human nature but then trying to look past it and appreciating the things we all have in common. Clubs can help with that, so can the media but they’d often prefer a story.’
And if you could only change one thing?
‘One thing wouldn’t be enough. We all need to be involved. My time at Sunderland helped move it forwards a little in the North East, Marcus is having a similar impact in Manchester… every little bit helps but changing mind-sets and making people think takes everyone.’
Talking to Benno, I’m struck by how tired he is of having this conversation again and again. We need to move forwards. We may no longer be in a world where players get bananas thrown at them and, thankfully, monkey chants are nowhere near as common as they once were but the direct contact possible through social media and, in my opinion, the fact we can somehow distance the human being from the recipient of a hate-filled tweet makes it even easier to throw whatever we want at people than it was before. Sometimes we even forget that they are people at all. I think remembering they’re humans before we consider anything else about them would completely change the way we interact, either through social media or from the stands.
Hearing one of your heroes spelling out how his own life has been so frequently touched by racism is hard. Hearing him say that we haven’t moved forwards in forty years is devastating. We need to act. Not just staying silent while others kneel but join in, speak to people, help move this ludicrous divide we have created into the past.
Gary Bennett was an incredible captain and player and I look forward to a day when the only colours that matter when we think of him are the colours of his football shirt.
